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» Smilin' Jack   » Specific Airline Discussions   » Jet Blue   » Hub protecting. Is it still worth it?

Author Topic: Hub protecting. Is it still worth it?
Post Captain
Member # 803

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With the recent announcement of Jet Blue pulling out of Atlanta, does anyone wonder if Hub protecting is still worth it?

Ok, So Delta, and Airtran kept them from being successfull in Atlanta. So they pack up and leave ATL and decide to try and make money without it, like they did 6 months ago. Could Delta really afford to loose their butts on flights to the West coast to keep them out? Maybe they see long term benefit, but Delta is still losing money. Delta still has Airtran to deal with.

TWA kept everyone but SW from establishing a worthwhile presence in STL, but did it help them? Who knows, the jury will be forever out as to wether or not TWA REALLY made money with STL. Supposedly they did. AAs recent downsizing in STL still leaves them with enough capacity at Lambert to seemingly try and keep the O&D business locked up. Will STL customers however remain faithfull, just because they have the largest presence here, or because of the high percentage of us that now have AAdvantage miles?

Look at the two airlines that try to keep ORD locked up. They are both losing money. Three airlines with hubs at the two busiest US airports, and THEY are the ones struggling, while the startups and younger airlines, Airtran, Jet Blue, Frontier, and even SW hand pick where they fly in and out of, and are doing OK.

Will JB look for a replacement for ATL? STL has some room now. Frontier I believe is marketing itself as an option West from STL, not just to Denver.

What does a JB TV ad look like? We are almost devoid of airline TV ads in STL, except for SW. AA likes billboards in STL....LOTS of Billboards! I believe Frontier is moving in with mainline equipment this time? The Talking Tails ads, (which I saw in Orlando recently), would be refreshing in STL.

And that theory that an airline MUST have a comprehensive Cover the Earth route system to make money? Look at the ones that make money in todays environment. Except for SW, their route systems suck.


Posts: 414 | From: St. Louis, Mo  |  IP: Logged
Post Captain
Member # 259

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I've seen quite a few American TV ads here in Philly, promoting business travel .. those 'I Fly American' ads.

According to, American is #2 in volume here after USAir. I'd love to see American add a couple of destinations out of here ... we have routes to almost every hub/hublet here (BOS, MIA, SJU, RDU, STL, ORD, DFW) .. but nothing to the west coast or even to NYC.

With the opening of Terminal A-West (International), I was hoping that American would pick up some gate space and add a city or two at some point in the future ...

Just this morning though, on the business wire, Southwest announced they're coming here starting Spring 2004. Never flown them yet. My biggest concern with that, is if they're going to fly PHL-STL, American could drop or cut back its flights on that leg in response to the competition .. a leg I fly 6-8 round trips/year. They're already cutting back from an MD80 to an ER4 starting next month. [Eek!]


Posts: 160 | From: Philadelphia, PA  |  IP: Logged
Post Captain
Member # 259

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An update to my previous post!

About Southwest coming to PHL in 2004 - it's reported that they are going to be using 4 gates "previously occupied by American" - since American is still heavily using its gates in Terminal A (A2-5, A7, A9), I'm guessing this refers to the gates TWA used in Terminal E (E8 and E10a-b-c). Those gates currently, still have TWA logos on the jetways ... probably not for much longer though. Aside from a few pieces of red and white ground equipment with AA decals on top, those jetways are the only visible sign of TWA left at PHL.

Right now the E10 gates are just being used to park equipment and an occasional jet to free up gates ... but not for boarding. E8 is being sublet to ATA currently and I know that a couple years back, Northwest put in a bid to lease those gates but that never materialized (Northwest uses E2-4-6).


Posts: 160 | From: Philadelphia, PA  |  IP: Logged
Post Captain
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You mentioned you were courious about Jetblue TV ads. Heres a link to some of those spots (hope you have a high-speed line).


Posts: 281 | From: Chappaqua, NY  |  IP: Logged
Post Captain
Member # 722

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When Jet Blue left ATL they said it was to redeploy assets to BOS where they felt they could be more profitable.

"Last month (September - my edit), JetBlue announced plans to launch service between Boston and Fort Lauderdale, Orlando and Tampa, FL and Denver, CO in the new year. By January 17, the airline is now scheduled to serve Logan International with two daily flights to Long Beach, three daily flights to Orlando, two daily flights to Tampa, and one daily flight each to Fort Lauderdale and Denver."

Now if they would only compete with Song on the BOS-RSW route...


Posts: 1634 | From: Hampton, NH  |  IP: Logged

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